Why Skepta versus Joyner Lucas didn’t work

After the New York rapper Jim Jones started insulting Nas last month and realized how easy it is to get one’s name in people’s mouths by doing so, the latest rap star to follow this method of maddening brand destruction is London’s Skepta, a veteran of the UK Grime scene. On July 3rd, right before Independence Day, he tweeted that he wished to take on an American rapper. Convenient, no? Americans will be feeling particularly patriotic this time of year. A key reason for this seemingly random motive to take on the home of Hip-Hop, the United States, is that Skepta is friends with perennial Pop star and alleged pedophile Drake.

They aren’t just friends — they have matching tattoos! That’s right, two of the biggest rap stars of the UK and Canada are out here boasting about primitive ink based on Drake’s record label OVO Sound. Some might suggest Skepta is out here secretly supporting soccer’s Sheffield Wednesday, or that bragging about matching tattoos is something 19-year-old women do when they stumble back from a week in Ayia Napa, but Drake is the key reason this “battle” kicked off in the first place.

Skepta gave us a clue that this was Drake’s doing by specifically asking for a battle with A$AP Rocky, who is conveniently married to Drake’s ex, Rihanna. Are you still with us? I know, it’s like an episode of Love Island.

`While many may have dismissed Skepta’s tweet about the UK vs. USA as a moment of delusion, Massachusetts emcee Joyner Lucas (most famous for his “I’m Not a Racist” viral rap video) took the bait and accepted the challenge laid down by BBK’s 42-year-old. Skepta dropped the track “Friendly Fire”, and he ended up giving Joyner Lucas more than just two bars that he initially promised. The problem with this track, and each subsequent effort that has emerged over the last two weeks, is that it makes both emcees and both countries look stupid.

Round 1

A Grime emcee entering into a rap battle with an American rapper is a bit like a bare-knuckle boxer entering the WWE. There’s a different skillset, a different language and different rules that make the two types of rapper incompatible. Skepta is happy to scrap; he doesn’t mind having a scruffy style that switches unpredictably, and while his presence commands the listener’s ear, he’s placing his rhymes in unorthodox ways to a traditional Hip-Hop listener. There’s no build-up to heavy haymakers that get a reaction. The beatdrops are unconventional, emphasising the wrong bars.

I think “Friendly Fire” is a perfectly decent song, but it’s littered with sloppy bars. Faux pas like repeating words (“the place I hang is a real dark place”), bizarre, needy statements like “I need Flex to play this, I need Semtex to play this” and then leaning into his accent with corny, overly British sentiments like “Joyner Lucas, you bastard”. That last one sounds ridiculous, and I’m saying that as Brit. To be fair, Skepta, along with his brother JME, are two of the more polite Grime emcees out there, opting for conversational, relatable deliveries over excessively aggressive posturing that you might get from a Ghetts. In that sense, Skepta is already at a disadvantage by even entering the battle rap arena, as his delivery throughout “Friendly Fire” is just too, well, friendly.

“Why you rap like you studied at Harvard?”

Skepta

The culture clash is furthered by this next line, where he’s mocking the fast, machine-gun flow that Joyner Lucas utilises, not because Harvard is something you’d be proud of as an American, but because if you’re a street rapper in the UK, you wouldn’t be proud of rapping like you went to Oxford. This is a perspective that unfortunately persists — like how the smart kid at school gets bullied for being smart. It’s a backwards logic, and one that emanates from Skepta’s generation, where only the privileged went to university. The class system is very much still in place in the UK, differing from the US, where it’s considered aspirational and a badge of honour to have been to university, especially Harvard. In the UK, that screams privilege, and is far from the murky, pirate radio scene Skepta emerged in.

There’s a well-known joke in the UK: “How do you know someone has been to Oxford?” “Don’t worry, they’ll tell you”.

“You think you’re doin’ me like them other Emcees?
How, Sway? You ain’t got the answers for these
In this war ting, I got a Master’s degree
The façade fallin’ apart and they’re startin’ to see
All eyes on me, I got the juice, I’m with the gang
Supermodels hit ’em up
It’s poetic justice, you laugh at my accent when I rap
But your wife fell in love with an English man”

Skepta shoots himself in the foot here, though, because he’s boasting about having the equivalent of a Master’s degree when he’s just criticised Joyner for rapping like he has one (from one of the best universities in the world, no less). The Tupac scheme he includes went over a few heads, but I think that’s probably because many younger listeners aren’t aware of the reference points. It’s a stretch, but it could well be subliminal shots to the West Coast, which is Kendrick Lamar’s home territory.

The lines aimed at A$AP Rocky like “You haven’t had a hit song for the longest, Too concerned with your clothes, should be focusin’ on flows” are so light-touch that they barely register. Stating that he’s had hit songs in the first place is a compliment.

So how did Joyner Lucas respond?

“Nobody Cares” is similarly lowkey, stacked with filler and indirect jabs toward the UK, rather than Skepta. For someone known for their storytelling songs, he spends a lot of time saying very little.

“Who want smoke? Gimme the blunt, I’m ready to blaze a corpse (Do it)
After this song is over, I never wan’ hear this debate no more (For real)
I ain’t wanna do it, but somebody told me he saying my name, it’s war (Joyner)
I wanna know what drugs you taking and what do you take me for?
Maybe you mad ’cause you ain’t got buzz up in the UK no more (You mad)
I heard your career just ain’t what it was and you don’t get paid no more (Facts)
If you wanna fеature, nigga, just say it, but you gotta pay me for it (Say that)
And after I body you, I don’t want you еver saying my name anymore (Grrt-grrt)
I know you putting your flag all on your back, now you gotta carry it (Aha)
If somebody holding it down, it shouldn’t be you, it’s time to be serious (Serious)
I know you hate being home, you come to the States and try to be arrogant (Yeah)
I bet you sit in your room and secretly wish that you was American”

Joyner populates his two verses with a lot of short words that aid his rapid-fire flow, but none of it makes sense. What’s quickly apparent is that Joyner hasn’t researched his opponent outside of the fact that he knows he’s from the UK and is pals with Drake.

Firstly, Skepta is a Grime artist, not a UK rapper (check the Giggs video below for context on this). Secondly, rap has been in the UK since the 1980s when Derek B was utilising an American accent (which would have been a good diss at UK Rap in general); Skepta arrived on the scene a good twenty years later. Thirdly, rappers in the UK don’t represent “coasts” like they do in the States; the country is simply too small and is split by North and South. Skepta reps London, which isn’t on any coast. Fourthly, the flagrant use of the n-word highlights this difference in culture — it’s not thrown around in the UK in that same way. Similarly, the gun threats don’t really hit when you’re more likely to be stabbed in Tottenham.

“The pistol black, your face get lit
The clip is packed, so make a wish, I’ll go to your town, I’ll take a trip (boom-boom)
I’ll wipe you down and take your pic, my money is blue, I’m way too rich (boom-boom, boom)
I made too much like way too quick, your music sucks, you make me sick”

When you read what Joyner Lucas is saying, it quickly becomes apparent that he isn’t interested in tearing Skepta apart. He admits this, saying “ain’t even wanna respond, but n****s in London told me take care of it”, despite proactively accepting Skepta’s challenge in the first place. Make your mind up.

After Round 1, I thought both were poor diss tracks but solid enough songs.

Round 2

On “Round 2” Skepta is providing some details for the more observant rap fans and has some solid rebuttals to Joyner’s first-round diss. It kicks off with a chant synonymous with Arsenal FC that they sing to Tottenham (where Skepta is from), but flips it to aim it at Joyner. This is something that only those tuned into football/soccer in the UK will clock, and this is exactly where Skepta shoots himself in the foot throughout the rest of this battle.

The way the beat drops over random lines means goofy phrases like “big toe” and “loads of mucus” end up getting more attention than I expect was intentional, because neither of these biological terms are making any connection. Additionally, all of the references Skepta uses are two decades old (or more!), with names like Master P, Young Buck and a reference to the 1995 Source Awards (where Andre 3K made his infamous speech). Along with the Tupac references from “Friendly Fire”, this makes Skepta look ridiculously out of touch, particularly with the modern Hip-Hop scene.

“I don’t wish I was anything else
I’m a British-Nigerian Black man
Why would I wish I was you when you wanna be Eminem?
Blud, you’re the Black Stan”

This is the only bar that was any good, as much of “Round 2” is spent addressing Joyner Lucas’ “Nobody Cares” lyrics, which makes sense when you’re on stage clashing with a Grime emcee, or applying freestyle skills in a Hip-Hop battle. But in 2025, rap battles are heavily rehearsed, intricate pieces of advanced wordplay — this all feels very simplistic by comparison. UK rapper Giggs tries to address this distinction between Grime and Hip-Hop, because the USA isn’t always aware of the differences, and it’s a key element of why this battle doesn’t work.

I wrote an article about something similar nine years ago, after seeing too many Grime albums being reviewed as Hip-Hop albums.

Joyner Lucas came back with “Round 2 K.O.”, but again, it’s another underwhelming offering that has little in common with Canibus’ “Second Round Knockout” that rocked LL Cool J back in 1998. Much of it is further rebuttals at Skepta, but again, sees the few disses barely register because of cultural differences. When Joyner boasts that being compared to Eminem is a good thing, citing how he’s the best-selling rapper around, it doesn’t hide the fact that Eminem has been derided by Hip-Hop fans for over a decade. Eminem is one of the greatest emcees of all time off the back of his early material, which elevated lyricism in the mainstream. Joyner’s style, and what Skepta is comparing him to, is the corny syllable-spilling Eminem of the last ten years. Joyner then proves Skepta’s point by delivering a hollow Eminem-style flow that reaffirms why being an Eminem knock-off isn’t a good thing. Fair play to Joyner for utilising a Grime beat, but there’s just no charm or targeted attacks.

“Put the UK/US shit to the side, this is me against you, lil’ pop boy
Clean up on aisle six, I done wiped this bitch, somebody come bring me a mop, boy
I done turned your stuff to a crime scene
Why the fuck a n**** thinkin’ he could try me?
How you do your n**** Wiley dirty, then turn your back on the UK grime scene? (On God)
You a snake ass ho, you slimy
You irrelevant, bitch, you behind me (Behind me)
I don’t even understand how you still got fans
I ain’t heard your name since the ‘90s”

I liked the last line, as it adds some much-needed humour, even evoking memories of Nas mentioning that Jay-Z was “36 in a karate class?” on 2001’s “Ether”. Jay-Z wasn’t 36, he was 31, but exaggeration is always a fun tool in battle rap. The fact Skepta pointed out that “actually you’ll find that I was only 9 years old in the 90s” completely misses the point and reminds us why he’s probably not the best emcee for a battle.

Menitoning Wiley and Giggs in this track makes me wonder if Joyner did a bit more research this time, but these moments are so few and far between that it’s mostly remembered for how tidy the Worcester emcee’s flow is over different beats. The bars just don’t carry enough weight.

Round 3

Skepta didn’t take long to fire out a third diss track called “Junior’s Law”, and it’s probably the best of all of these songs, if we’re going by the actual verbal attacks.

“It’s war, Joyner, don’t flop, you know that I ain’t nice (Ugh)
Catch him at the night show, now he’s got stage fright (Greaze)
You know what I spray like, clips loaded
Hit him with cannons from the arsenal, he ain’t seeing daylight (Ah, boom-boom!)
I’ll do it hands-free, no DNA
I’ll holler at my hitman, he can hit you from twenty feet away
Well, it’s a horror movie if he pulls out the shotty
You ain’t scaring anybody, man, this clash was a piece of cake
You think you’re seeing Skeppy today? I’m Nicholas Cage (Nah)
Gone in sixty seconds, no Minute Maid (Nyoom)
But I got the juice now, Joyner can’t take the pain
You lost your chances of ever being in D12, and I’ll take the blame
It’s the fashion killer, think I need a pink Polo
Dropped “Round 2” on your release date, oh no (Grrt)
Took you another week to reply, you were so slow (Why?)
Said you’re pushing your album like this ain’t promo (Joyner)
Remember, this is all Drew’s mad plan
Think he need to get his head checked, need to get him a CAT scan (Grrt)
’Cause he ain’t Blacc Sam
And I never said that you’re the Black Eminem, boy, I said you’re the Black Stan”

Again, we get outdated references to D12 and Gone in 60 Seconds, reminding us all that Skepta is a rapper in his forties. The battle rap scheme that uses Don’t Flop, DNA, Arsonal, Daylyt, Shotty Horrah et al is commendable, but only reminded me how far Skepta’s style and music is from that scene. Skepta’s battle bars are more like nursery rhymes by comparison.

There’s a scruffiness to Skepta’s second verse where he drops off beat and then jumps back; this is something that a mechanically tight rapper like Joyner Lucas visibly turns his nose up at in his video response to this track. In that sense, “Junior’s Law” reminded me of the days when rappers dropped “freestyle” disses over someone else’s beat. It might be scruffy or less refined — it might be low budget and more akin to a battle on stage.

However good or bad you find Skepta’s approach, I really struggled to find the positives in this section of his second verse.

“I’m in the booth on my birthday, killer
Your first name’s Gary (Uh?)
So you know we gotta put him in the grave like your surname’s Glitter (Boom, burn him!)
And don’t leave your girl ‘round me, that’s foolish
Always on time, man, I thought that you knew this (Yeah)
I don’t rock with you or your music (Nah)
What’s love? Fuck that, I just shoot shit (Greaze)
I’ve never been robbed, you bozo
And I’m outside, see me walking dolo
If a man ever try to touch my chain (What?)
Leave him looking like the Jordan logo (Greaze)”

There’s a lot to unpick here. Recording in the booth on your birthday is, quite frankly, a bit sad. Especially when the opponent cannot justify even answering that effort. You’ve got a Gary Glitter punchline that nobody in the United States is going to get, before then following a bar about a paedophile with “don’t leave your girl ‘round me”. Obviously, that’s not his intent, but it’s not a good transition. This then leads into an Ashanti scheme (she made songs called Foolish, Rock Wit U and What’s Love?), because Joyner made a song with Ashanti? Did Drake want Ashanti too? I’m so confused.

I don’t blame Joyner for opting out of this trash heap.

Let’s address Drake’s initial statement that ignited this non-debate:

“London rappers are the best lyricists in the world… No disrespect to America, but nobody in the world can out-rap London rappers”.

Drake

London does have some fine lyricists, but you can’t make that statement and not give examples. The rappers he wheels out (Central Cee, J Hus) are not lyricists in the way Americans understand them. When you think of a lyricist, you think of artists who are dangerous with the pen. Vicious writers like Pusha T, Black Thought and Kendrick Lamar, and that’s before you get to the truly merciless wordsmiths like Lupe Fiasco and 38 Spesh. The only emcees in the UK that operate in that echelon are either retired (Possessed, Akala), or you just can’t see them wasting ink on verbal abuse instead of crafting acclaimed albums (Little Simz, Cappo).

But this is helpful for Drake, because nobody has looked worse than Drake has in the last year or so. By making a bunch of other rappers look stupid, it makes him look less stupid. Even though he’s trying to out-stupid everyone by saying things nobody believes, like “London has the best lyricists in the world”. He didn’t even go to a Dizzee Rascal. If he had mentioned Mic Righteous, or Krept N Konan, or Chip. Hell, Little Simz. Simz is right there, and the Americans know of her! The timing of this also highlights Drake’s involvement — the Clipse dropped their long-awaited fourth album on the eleventh of July, and Drake has history with Pusha T. This nonsensical feud between the UK and US has successfully distracted a lot of eyes and ears from what’s one of the year’s best rap albums. It’s petty.

The UK never asked for this. There is no debate, because you’re comparing apples with oranges. It’s like saying Nigeria has the best rappers in the world — most of the world isn’t interested in exploring that argument because it’s easier to dismiss the one or two rappers they’ve heard and move on with their life. But more importantly, the rappers being rolled out in these comparisons aren’t Hip-Hop rappers. The UK isn’t helping itself with terrible contributions from TV chef Big Zuu, comedian Unknown P, and genuine fire-spitter Mic Righteous defending Eminem in a battle that’s likely not even on his radar. It plays into the stereotype of Americans inherently not taking UK rappers seriously.

On a more practical level, it’s worth reminding people that the US is five times more populated than the UK and is forty times the size. It’s a big mismatch, but something that hasn’t really been mentioned is how the UK has been punching above its weight for a while. If you take a look at the music, specifically the critically acclaimed music on Wikipedia, the UK has half of the best rap albums released this year (6 out of 10, or 7 out of 15):

What Drake should have said is that the UK (or London) has the best Hip-Hop music, and he might have been more accurate in his assessment. There’s your debate. I think the UK is destined to always come up short in a straight-up rap battle, but there were opportunities here for Skepta to cause damage. The fact that Joyner Lucas is from New England and Skepta is from the original England, for a start. Talking about big toes and hacking up mucus — it doesn’t do the UK any favours.

The US also doesn’t come out of this nonsense unscathed. Because whenever it comes to international music, particularly rap or rap-adjacent, it continues to highlight the bubble that the US remains comfortably stuck inside. I get it, there’s more than enough music released from American artists alone, so why would most Americans bother exploring international offerings? The past two weeks have seen journalists turned Youtubers like Toure, Justin Hunte and Curtiss King clowning British rap, openly admitting that they aren’t familiar with rap outside the US. They don’t listen to Black music if it’s not American. “Yeah, I liked Slick Rick back in the day” or “I like UK rap, Dizzee Rascal is dope, So Solid Crew is dope”. Much like Skepta himself, your reference points are over twenty years out of date, lads. That’s pre-Grime — So Solid is Garage. What this battle has highlighted is how the US audience, unless it’s already dialled into the different beats and language of UK Rap, will opt to dismiss Skepta and his booming British accent off the bat. The one channel I’ve seen try to understand the differences is seasoned battle rapper Math Hoffa, although his bias and ignorance still masks any structural writing criticisms he has, which feels like a missed opportunity. Skepta even included subtitles in the third round, but by that point, Americans had already made their decision, choosing to interpret terms like ‘harmattan’ as ‘Hammer-Time’ because even Googling is hard work these days.

Let’s step back and observe why the UK vs. USA will never be a battle worth happening.

Many in the US aren’t familiar with the English dialect and its various accents and styles, outside of upper-class caricatures beamed in from the Royal Family, national treasure Idris Elba, or the latest batch of Taskmaster comedians. Netflix’s Adolescence being so popular hopefully starts to break that image. That’s not to dismiss the many anglophiles that exist in the US, but seeing Skepta getting hauled over coals for his poor diss tracks needs further context.

It goes both ways, of course, and many Brits make assumptions of Americans with their own ear-splitting accents, the insular ignorance that much of the world agrees on, and the ludicrous fact that Trump was elected president. Twice. We’ve been here before with listeners ignorant of the rapper E-40. It’s taken me years to finally enjoy Bruiser Wolf. There are similar reasons why Iggy Azalea doesn’t rhyme with the same accent as Crocodile Dundee — the Americans wouldn’t and cannot accept it. It’s why you still see badly dubbed versions of Korean dramas on Netflix. I think this is improving, but this battle has shown that this ignorance and insular outlook on music remains prevalent. You only have to watch the recent Drink Champs interview with Estelle, where the hosts aren’t interested in Estelle or her journey, just the American artists she has worked with (like Kanye West). It’s really quite disrespectful.

This uphill battle that Skepta was always going to face is evident when you look at the numbers. Most people on YouTube are just listening to half of the battle (the US side):

• Skepta’s “Friendly Fire” — 288k views
• Joyner Lucas’ “Nobody Cares” — 1.7m
• Skepta’s “Round 2” — 507k
• Joyner Lucas’ “Round 2 KO” — 978k
• Skepta’s “Junior’s Law” — 137k

It’s interesting because more people listen to Skepta on Spotify, if you go by current monthly listeners:

There isn’t just a difference in audiences for the two emcees. If we look at the touring cities that both artists have completed since March 2014, it’s staring us in the face at why these numbers are the way they are:

If you break this down by country, Joyner Lucas is in the US or Canada 94% of the time:

Skepta’s numbers are quite different, split between English-speaking countries (USA, UK, Australia, Canada, New Zealand) 62% of the time, with 38% of his toured cities with English as a second language.

Joyner Lucas is heavily US-centric, whereas Skepta is a global artist. It’s obvious from Skepta’s perspective, because the UK is only a small audience when it comes to rap, Hip-Hop or Grime, but it proves why Joyner and his fans may be unaware of someone like Skepta in the first place. Conversely, it shows why the rest of the world is more accustomed to Skepta’s strange accent.

So while this whole charade may feel a bit stupid because Joyner nor Skepta managed to impress, neither of them is really losing. This has helped drive their numbers up at a time when nobody is saying “throw that Skepta shit on”, and I’m sure some (I’m one of them) will only be throwing that new Joyner Lucas shit on because I’m now curious if his album has more substance than his diss tracks do.

The only real winner here is, unremarkably, Kendrick Lamar. He’s sat at home playing 4D chess, laughing into his iPhone at the carnage that’s unfolding across the Atlantic. Drake, however, comes across as desperate, and I’d chalk this up as another loss on his part, because this battle hasn’t proven anything when it comes to lyricism. Drake has made this a London vs. USA thing, because he doesn’t have any interest in the UK more broadly. He’s not rocking up in Bristol or Glasgow, he’s not on the ground immersing himself in these scenes. Drake is doing what works for Drake, and in this case, he’s using his allies outside the US to let off some aftershock following last year’s heavy loss to Kendrick.